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ball stuck in stairway of bunker

 
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ragarwala

Joined: 13 May 2009
Posts: 1

PostPosted: Tue Jun 09, 2009 3:49 pm    Post subject: ball stuck in stairway of bunker

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On my tee shot the ball fell in the fairway bunker - this bunker had 3 deep steps and the ball was unplayable - question is where do u take the relief - away from the hole puts me outside the bunker - any other drop puts me in the bunker - but closer to the hole...
 
shoetick

Joined: 20 Oct 2008
Posts: 8

PostPosted: Wed Jun 10, 2009 7:03 am    Post subject: Re: ball stuck in stairway of bunker

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Rule 24-2: http://www.usga.org/bookrule.aspx?id=14300#24-2

(ii)In a Bunker: If the ball is in a bunker, the player must lift the ball and drop it either:

(a) Without penalty, in accordance with Clause(i) above, except that the nearest point of relief must be in the bunker and the ball must be dropped in the bunker; or

(b) Under penalty of one stroke, outside the bunker keeping the point where the ball lay directly between the hole and the spot on which the ball is dropped, with no limit to how far behind the bunker the ball may be dropped.
laterider
Joined: 19 Aug 2009
Posts: 14

PostPosted: Tue Aug 25, 2009 2:22 pm    Post subject: Relief within a bunker

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Shoetick, I am unclear what he means by steps in the bunker. If these are footprints in the bunker, are you saying he can take relief? I thought that any blemish in the bunker was just the hazard of being in a bunker. I haven't seen any bunker with steps cut into the sand so footprints are the only thing I can envision. But taking relief from a footprint doesn't seem reasonable. The section of the rules you referred to is talking about immovable obstructions. Would you explain further please?
 
shoetick

Joined: 20 Oct 2008
Posts: 8

PostPosted: Tue Aug 25, 2009 6:16 pm    Post subject: Re: Relief within a bunker

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laterider wrote:
Shoetick, I am unclear what he means by steps in the bunker. If these are footprints in the bunker, are you saying he can take relief? I thought that any blemish in the bunker was just the hazard of being in a bunker. I haven't seen any bunker with steps cut into the sand so footprints are the only thing I can envision. But taking relief from a footprint doesn't seem reasonable. The section of the rules you referred to is talking about immovable obstructions. Would you explain further please?


I can't remember what my mind thought but there may be a bunker so deep that you have steps to get into it. Anyhow, it's been a while since this post, but the question, which I quoted from the USGA rule book, was how to take relief in a bunker, I didn't post whether or not his lie deemed relief worthy.
 
blackhawk

Joined: 02 Nov 2008
Posts: 68

PostPosted: Tue Aug 25, 2009 11:35 pm    Post subject:

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@laterider, you are correct that you do not get relief from footprints. I believe the question refers to steps made out of railroad ties leading into a deep pot bunker. if so the question is then, are they considered an immoveable obstruction or part of the bunker?
 
SingleDigits

Joined: 27 Jun 2008
Posts: 253

PostPosted: Tue Oct 27, 2009 11:19 am    Post subject:

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Interesting question. I think it depends whether the ball is considered in the bunker. Per the definition below, I think stairs leading into a bunker are not considered part of a bunker and therefore you can get free relief and drop outside the bunker without penalty.

If the ball is considered in the hazard and taking a drop in the bunker would put you closer to the hole then you'd have to drop outside the bunker with a one shot penalty.

USGA definition:

A "bunker" is a hazard consisting of a prepared area of ground, often a hollow, from which turf or soil has been removed and replaced with sand or the like.

Grass-covered ground bordering or within a bunker, including a stacked turf face (whether grass-covered or earthen), is not part of the bunker. A wall or lip of the bunker not covered with grass is part of the bunker. The margin of a bunker extends vertically downwards, but not upwards.

A ball is in a bunker when it lies in or any part of it touches the bunker.
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